SLAUGHTER & THE DOGS
As one of the bands at the forefront of Manchesters’ early Punk Rock scene, Slaughter & The Dogs have never really received the critical respect that they deserve, even .;/though their popularity amongst the fans has always remained strong. They may well have been affected and inspired when they played alongside the Sex Pistols at one of the legendary Lesser Free Trade Hall gigs in Manchester during 1976, but they were also open about their rock’n’roll roots and their attitude reflected their real, working class upbringing, which didn’t fit-in with the mythology that the music press were already putting in place. Regardless, they were also one of the first Manchester bands to begin regularly playing in London, helping to break ground for the many bands that followed. They also released the first single on the independent Rabid label, the classic ‘Cranked Up Really High’, produced by Martin Hannett. Unfortunately, they made an error in signing to Decca, a label on the decline and unprepared for their raucous brand of music, but nonetheless managed to release what many consider to be their greatest single, ‘Where Have All The Bootboys Gone ?’ and the excellent debut album, ‘Do It Dog Style’. Had they been on a label who were a bit more on-the-ball, surely they would have had much more success.
However, various situations led to a split, and although several reunions and further records emerged over the next few years, after 1979 the band were not heard again until they released a new album, ‘Shocking’ in 1991. They didn’t play live at that time, but eventually returned to the stage at the ‘Holidays in the Sun’ festival in 1996. Since then, they have recorded and played live on a sporadic basis, mostly as a result of Mick Rossi now being resident in California while Wayne Barrett lives in France. Most recently, they performed their 40th Anniversary gig in Manchester featuring all four original members and then went on with the current line-up to release their latest album, ‘Vicious’ on Cleopatra Records, receiving positive reviews for both.
However, various situations led to a split, and although several reunions and further records emerged over the next few years, after 1979 the band were not heard again until they released a new album, ‘Shocking’ in 1991. They didn’t play live at that time, but eventually returned to the stage at the ‘Holidays in the Sun’ festival in 1996. Since then, they have recorded and played live on a sporadic basis, mostly as a result of Mick Rossi now being resident in California while Wayne Barrett lives in France. Most recently, they performed their 40th Anniversary gig in Manchester featuring all four original members and then went on with the current line-up to release their latest album, ‘Vicious’ on Cleopatra Records, receiving positive reviews for both.
With two dates announced at the 100 Club, their first London shows for quite some time, I decided to take the opportunity to set-up an interview. Due to their other commitments, I’d have to wait until the second evening, but at least this gave me the chance to watch the current line-up live before going ahead with the interrogation.
I arrived at what I thought was an early time, intending to see the support set from the DeRellas, only to find that they had already played and that Slaughter & the Dogs were due onstage at 9.15. With only minutes to spare, I grab a drink and find myself a good vantage point close to the stage.
Starting with a song from the new album, ‘Trust’, they quickly establish their tough, rock’n’roll sound, before delving back to their version of ‘Who Are The Mystery Girls’ and the b-side of their first single, ‘The Bitch’. The set continued at a strong pace, including both old and new titles and the audience reacted in boisterous fashion. ‘Boston Babies’ and ‘I’m Mad’ get a particularly great response, but so does new song ‘Trash Talking Queen’. Wayne Barrett may look older, but his voice is still just how it should be, while Mick Rossi remains one of the more exciting guitarists you’re likely to see. The set eventually comes to an end with the excellent ‘Situations’, a cover of ‘Get It On’ and the inevitable blast of ‘Cranked Up Really High’. Can it get any better than this ? Well, for the encore, they excel themselves. Longtime friend and associate Tony James joins them onstage, for a great version of the Generation X classic ‘Ready Steady Go’ and the ultimate show-stopper, ‘Where Have All The Bootboys Gone ?’ Despite cheers for more, that has to be the end – how could anyone follow that ? And, anyway, there’s a second night still to come…
I arrived at what I thought was an early time, intending to see the support set from the DeRellas, only to find that they had already played and that Slaughter & the Dogs were due onstage at 9.15. With only minutes to spare, I grab a drink and find myself a good vantage point close to the stage.
Starting with a song from the new album, ‘Trust’, they quickly establish their tough, rock’n’roll sound, before delving back to their version of ‘Who Are The Mystery Girls’ and the b-side of their first single, ‘The Bitch’. The set continued at a strong pace, including both old and new titles and the audience reacted in boisterous fashion. ‘Boston Babies’ and ‘I’m Mad’ get a particularly great response, but so does new song ‘Trash Talking Queen’. Wayne Barrett may look older, but his voice is still just how it should be, while Mick Rossi remains one of the more exciting guitarists you’re likely to see. The set eventually comes to an end with the excellent ‘Situations’, a cover of ‘Get It On’ and the inevitable blast of ‘Cranked Up Really High’. Can it get any better than this ? Well, for the encore, they excel themselves. Longtime friend and associate Tony James joins them onstage, for a great version of the Generation X classic ‘Ready Steady Go’ and the ultimate show-stopper, ‘Where Have All The Bootboys Gone ?’ Despite cheers for more, that has to be the end – how could anyone follow that ? And, anyway, there’s a second night still to come…
Arriving next day at soundcheck time, I meet with Wayne and, after a few delays, we find some space in the dressing room to begin the interview. Mick Rossi is also in the vicinity and at several points joins the conversation.
I began by asking Wayne about a comment he had made onstage the previous night, that these dates were the first time Slaughter & The Dogs had ever played at the 100 Club…
‘Yeah, and I didn’t actually realize that until I went onstage. Someone mentioned as we were going on that it was the first time we’d ever played here and I suddenly thought, yeah, it is. I came here several times to see other bands in the late Seventies, but we never played here.’
Going back to the beginning, had you been involved in any other bands before Slaughter & The Dogs ?
‘Not really, no. The birth of Slaughter & The Dogs came about while Mick and myself were still at school. We were at the same school in Wythenshawe and I first met Mick in the schoolyard because we were both big Bowie fans. I was learning to play double-bass, so I asked Mick if he wanted to have a go. He wasn’t keen at first, but then I told him it was getting me out of about 70% of my lessons, so he said, ‘I’m having that !’ But he didn’t really get along with double-bass as it was a bit too big for him, so he went from that instrument to the guitar. That was when we started writing things together, although we were just churning out songs to begin with. They were bad copies of T-Rex, Bowie or Lou Reed, you know, but we decided to put a band together. First, we brought Muffet in to play drums, and I also knew Howard Bates, so it just started-off like that. It really was a schoolboy band to begin with, so none of us were in any other bands before that. This would’ve been 1975 and we were only just learning to play.’
Is it true that you initially called yourselves The Mime Troupe ?
‘Oh yeah, hahaha ! It was called Wayne Barrett & The Mime Troupe, which was totally pretentious. But we loved Bowie and that had got me interested in Lindsay Kemp, which got me in to mime. I remember telling Mick that I’d like to do a bit of mime while we played the songs, and he was looking at me like….Errr, well, alright, I suppose…’ So that’s why we picked that name at the very beginning, but I soon saw some sense and we changed it very, very quickly ! It just wasn’t going to happen and we never even got to play under that name.’
I began by asking Wayne about a comment he had made onstage the previous night, that these dates were the first time Slaughter & The Dogs had ever played at the 100 Club…
‘Yeah, and I didn’t actually realize that until I went onstage. Someone mentioned as we were going on that it was the first time we’d ever played here and I suddenly thought, yeah, it is. I came here several times to see other bands in the late Seventies, but we never played here.’
Going back to the beginning, had you been involved in any other bands before Slaughter & The Dogs ?
‘Not really, no. The birth of Slaughter & The Dogs came about while Mick and myself were still at school. We were at the same school in Wythenshawe and I first met Mick in the schoolyard because we were both big Bowie fans. I was learning to play double-bass, so I asked Mick if he wanted to have a go. He wasn’t keen at first, but then I told him it was getting me out of about 70% of my lessons, so he said, ‘I’m having that !’ But he didn’t really get along with double-bass as it was a bit too big for him, so he went from that instrument to the guitar. That was when we started writing things together, although we were just churning out songs to begin with. They were bad copies of T-Rex, Bowie or Lou Reed, you know, but we decided to put a band together. First, we brought Muffet in to play drums, and I also knew Howard Bates, so it just started-off like that. It really was a schoolboy band to begin with, so none of us were in any other bands before that. This would’ve been 1975 and we were only just learning to play.’
Is it true that you initially called yourselves The Mime Troupe ?
‘Oh yeah, hahaha ! It was called Wayne Barrett & The Mime Troupe, which was totally pretentious. But we loved Bowie and that had got me interested in Lindsay Kemp, which got me in to mime. I remember telling Mick that I’d like to do a bit of mime while we played the songs, and he was looking at me like….Errr, well, alright, I suppose…’ So that’s why we picked that name at the very beginning, but I soon saw some sense and we changed it very, very quickly ! It just wasn’t going to happen and we never even got to play under that name.’
The earliest gig that everyone seems to know about is when you supported the Sex Pistols in July 1976 at the Lesser Free Trade Hall in Manchester. But you had actually already been playing live for a while before then…
‘Yeah, we’d already played quite a lot, actually. We’d started-off in ’75 playing at local Labour Clubs and even the local Conservative club in Wythenshawe. We played at any of the local places that would have us and then started to get gigs on the outskirts, places like Bolton and whatever. It had a bit of a snowball effect, the more we played, the more we got a little bit bigger, and that was the real reason why McLaren wanted us to play with the Pistols at that gig. The first time they played in Manchester, there was only a small crowd of people, so this time he wanted us to play on the bill because he’d found out that we were a pull, locally. So he invited us to play at the show and we said, Yeah ! We just liked the fact that we’d be playing at the Free Trade Hall, even if it was only the Lesser Free Trade Hall. The thing was, me and Mick were always going to those venues to see gigs and watch out idols, like Bowie and Ronson, so we were just excited to be playing at the same place as them, even if it was a different room.’
Had you been to the Sex Pistols’ first gig in Manchester ?
‘No. We were just contacted by McLaren and Howard Devoto about the second gig and they set up the deal with us. It was like a three-way deal. We didn’t really know who the Pistols were at that point. We’d seen a few of the early press reviews, but we didn’t really know much about them until we saw them onstage. That was the eye-opener. It was a really amazing experience and we were very happy that we were there.’
From the songs you used to cover, you were presumably into lesser-known American bands like the Velvet Underground and New York Dolls. Was that kind of music widely-available at that time ?
‘Well, not really. There was no internet back then, so we’d have to go to Piccadilly in the middle of Manchester and search through the record shops if we wanted to hear something like that. Me and Mick even used to meet up early in the morning once a week and go down to the newspaper distribution depot, to wait for the new copies of New Musical Express and Melody Maker to arrive. We wanted to be the first guys in Manchester to read and dissect all the information from the London press. That was our big thing back in the day… we’d find out about these things that were going on and then we’d have to go out and search for them.’
A punk scene quickly built-up in Manchester following those Sex Pistols gigs. Do you think the bands and people involved were quite supportive of each other, or was there a sense of rivalry ?
Wayne : I wouldn’t say there was any real rivalry, but there was a lot of difference. We were definitely not on the same wavelength as most of the other bands were. I think that’s the easiest way to put it. We just got along with what we were doing in our own world. I think we were set-apart from the rest of the bands because we were a bunch of bold-faced bastards and we said what we thought. We arse-licked nobody ! That was the Wythenshawe attitude and that’s how we were. Also, our guns were already loaded by the time most of the other bands even started to get together. We’d already been playing gigs for a year or so by then.’
Mick : I think there was a bit of a stigma because we really were working-class kids from a Council estate, while bands like Pete and Howard in the Buzzcocks were people who were going to College. So there was a bit of a stigma in there and some people looked at us as being uneducated, ill-advised and all of that. So that’s where the supposed-rivalry came from, but it was really just a bunch of working class kids on one hand and a bunch of Uni-kids on the other.
‘Yeah, we’d already played quite a lot, actually. We’d started-off in ’75 playing at local Labour Clubs and even the local Conservative club in Wythenshawe. We played at any of the local places that would have us and then started to get gigs on the outskirts, places like Bolton and whatever. It had a bit of a snowball effect, the more we played, the more we got a little bit bigger, and that was the real reason why McLaren wanted us to play with the Pistols at that gig. The first time they played in Manchester, there was only a small crowd of people, so this time he wanted us to play on the bill because he’d found out that we were a pull, locally. So he invited us to play at the show and we said, Yeah ! We just liked the fact that we’d be playing at the Free Trade Hall, even if it was only the Lesser Free Trade Hall. The thing was, me and Mick were always going to those venues to see gigs and watch out idols, like Bowie and Ronson, so we were just excited to be playing at the same place as them, even if it was a different room.’
Had you been to the Sex Pistols’ first gig in Manchester ?
‘No. We were just contacted by McLaren and Howard Devoto about the second gig and they set up the deal with us. It was like a three-way deal. We didn’t really know who the Pistols were at that point. We’d seen a few of the early press reviews, but we didn’t really know much about them until we saw them onstage. That was the eye-opener. It was a really amazing experience and we were very happy that we were there.’
From the songs you used to cover, you were presumably into lesser-known American bands like the Velvet Underground and New York Dolls. Was that kind of music widely-available at that time ?
‘Well, not really. There was no internet back then, so we’d have to go to Piccadilly in the middle of Manchester and search through the record shops if we wanted to hear something like that. Me and Mick even used to meet up early in the morning once a week and go down to the newspaper distribution depot, to wait for the new copies of New Musical Express and Melody Maker to arrive. We wanted to be the first guys in Manchester to read and dissect all the information from the London press. That was our big thing back in the day… we’d find out about these things that were going on and then we’d have to go out and search for them.’
A punk scene quickly built-up in Manchester following those Sex Pistols gigs. Do you think the bands and people involved were quite supportive of each other, or was there a sense of rivalry ?
Wayne : I wouldn’t say there was any real rivalry, but there was a lot of difference. We were definitely not on the same wavelength as most of the other bands were. I think that’s the easiest way to put it. We just got along with what we were doing in our own world. I think we were set-apart from the rest of the bands because we were a bunch of bold-faced bastards and we said what we thought. We arse-licked nobody ! That was the Wythenshawe attitude and that’s how we were. Also, our guns were already loaded by the time most of the other bands even started to get together. We’d already been playing gigs for a year or so by then.’
Mick : I think there was a bit of a stigma because we really were working-class kids from a Council estate, while bands like Pete and Howard in the Buzzcocks were people who were going to College. So there was a bit of a stigma in there and some people looked at us as being uneducated, ill-advised and all of that. So that’s where the supposed-rivalry came from, but it was really just a bunch of working class kids on one hand and a bunch of Uni-kids on the other.
Wayne : The thing was, we always thought of ourselves as a rock’n’roll band even though we were involved in the Punk era and had a lot of Punk fans. They liked us because we had that nitty-gritty attitude and were right in your face. That was the Punk-side of Mick and myself. That was our Punk attitude, but it was something that came from growing up in Wythenshaw, the place where hatred was created ! We just translated the kind of anger that we saw around us in to our music.
Mick : I think we saw ourselves as a street-wise rock’n’roll band, in the same sense that Eddie & the Hot Rods were. Of course, it all depends on how you define rock’n’roll, but to me, it’s always been about the attitude.
Wayne ; The problem is that the music press always have a tendency to categorise everything. Well, okay, to a certain extent it’s their job to do that, but how could they categorise something that was only just happening? Nobody could really say this-is-this and this-is-that because, at that point, it was all just creativity. I mean, of course there were origins coming from other bands in terms of songwriting, but as soon as people started saying we were one thing or another, I thought that was all a load of crap.
Mick : All we did was bring our street-sense to our music, because that was all we knew. When you’re a kid, your street is what it’s all about. We were from working class families and hanging out on the street was all we had. That was our roots and that’s what shapes you as an individual. We brought that sensibility to our music. We’d had to grow up very quickly and learn to look after ourselves, in a physical sense, so that was the attitude we brought to our music. We’d come at you fast and we’d come at you loud because it was the best we’d got.
It’s very much the same approach that was taken by Detroit bands like the Stooges or the MC5. They were working class bands playing in working class venues, so they knew they had to get up there and be good, because they weren’t going to get another chance…
‘That’s right. When the MC5 started off, it was the same sort of thing. There was all this hatred around them so they had to find a way to survive. They found a way that they wanted to do it and realised that they could become famous through their own creativity, music and lyrics.’
When you first came down to play in London, in January 1977, you were one of the first bands from outside London to start playing at places like The Roxy. What kind of response did you receive from the London audiences ?
“They’re not Cockney’s”, hahaha ! I think we were maybe pushed to the side a little bit, right at the beginning, but we had to do things like that to break the ice. We realised that we had to be persistent and say, Okay, we’re from Manchester, but we’re all in the same game. There were a lot of snobby attitudes wherever we went and you’ll always find that, but at the same time, there actually weren’t that many Punk bands around at that point, so if someone sounded good, you couldn’t afford to be too choosy. Andy Czezowski embraced us because he needed more bands to play at The Roxy, and he really helped us like that.’
Mick : I think we saw ourselves as a street-wise rock’n’roll band, in the same sense that Eddie & the Hot Rods were. Of course, it all depends on how you define rock’n’roll, but to me, it’s always been about the attitude.
Wayne ; The problem is that the music press always have a tendency to categorise everything. Well, okay, to a certain extent it’s their job to do that, but how could they categorise something that was only just happening? Nobody could really say this-is-this and this-is-that because, at that point, it was all just creativity. I mean, of course there were origins coming from other bands in terms of songwriting, but as soon as people started saying we were one thing or another, I thought that was all a load of crap.
Mick : All we did was bring our street-sense to our music, because that was all we knew. When you’re a kid, your street is what it’s all about. We were from working class families and hanging out on the street was all we had. That was our roots and that’s what shapes you as an individual. We brought that sensibility to our music. We’d had to grow up very quickly and learn to look after ourselves, in a physical sense, so that was the attitude we brought to our music. We’d come at you fast and we’d come at you loud because it was the best we’d got.
It’s very much the same approach that was taken by Detroit bands like the Stooges or the MC5. They were working class bands playing in working class venues, so they knew they had to get up there and be good, because they weren’t going to get another chance…
‘That’s right. When the MC5 started off, it was the same sort of thing. There was all this hatred around them so they had to find a way to survive. They found a way that they wanted to do it and realised that they could become famous through their own creativity, music and lyrics.’
When you first came down to play in London, in January 1977, you were one of the first bands from outside London to start playing at places like The Roxy. What kind of response did you receive from the London audiences ?
“They’re not Cockney’s”, hahaha ! I think we were maybe pushed to the side a little bit, right at the beginning, but we had to do things like that to break the ice. We realised that we had to be persistent and say, Okay, we’re from Manchester, but we’re all in the same game. There were a lot of snobby attitudes wherever we went and you’ll always find that, but at the same time, there actually weren’t that many Punk bands around at that point, so if someone sounded good, you couldn’t afford to be too choosy. Andy Czezowski embraced us because he needed more bands to play at The Roxy, and he really helped us like that.’
e You released your first single, ‘Cranked Up Really High’, through Rabid Records. Was the label already in existence before they released your single ?
‘Not really. We were sort of involved in getting it set-up, in a way, because we were their first release. We were friends with Tosh Ryan and Martin Hannett, and at first it was just an idea they had to set-up a small, independent record label. But they didn’t have any artists until they asked us. It started as an idea and they had to try to make it real.’
They certainly released a great record for their debut !
‘It’s an interesting single… looking back at it, there’s a lot of almost accidental creativity in that production. I remember Martin asking me to sing in the kitchen because there was a lot of marble in there and that produced a lot of natural reverb. Mick’s guitar also has a very unique sound on the record, which Martin helped him to get. He was definitely very important to us as a band at the very beginning, in terms of our sound, and he guided us very wisely. We got on really well with him, even though he was a hippy. That’s how he was in his mind and all the rest of it, and we were pretty rowdy in comparison, so there was a clash of character, but he’d always let us blow-off steam and then say, ‘Okay, have you finished ? Alright, now listen to me…’ And he was right most of the time. He analyzed us pretty well, so it was always interesting.’
Lyrically, the song was quite ambiguous, describing a situation concerning drugs rather than condemning or glamorising it…
‘It was basically about all the junk that me and all my friends were taking at the time. We were just trying to get out of Dodge, basically. We were trying to do something to get out of the reality of living in Wythenshawe. The lyrics are talking about all of that… Like, the line, ‘pushing pills for a rock’n’roll band…’ I knew plenty of guys who were dealing and doing just that, so it’s really just about drug-life in Wythenshawe and what was going on at the time.’
‘Not really. We were sort of involved in getting it set-up, in a way, because we were their first release. We were friends with Tosh Ryan and Martin Hannett, and at first it was just an idea they had to set-up a small, independent record label. But they didn’t have any artists until they asked us. It started as an idea and they had to try to make it real.’
They certainly released a great record for their debut !
‘It’s an interesting single… looking back at it, there’s a lot of almost accidental creativity in that production. I remember Martin asking me to sing in the kitchen because there was a lot of marble in there and that produced a lot of natural reverb. Mick’s guitar also has a very unique sound on the record, which Martin helped him to get. He was definitely very important to us as a band at the very beginning, in terms of our sound, and he guided us very wisely. We got on really well with him, even though he was a hippy. That’s how he was in his mind and all the rest of it, and we were pretty rowdy in comparison, so there was a clash of character, but he’d always let us blow-off steam and then say, ‘Okay, have you finished ? Alright, now listen to me…’ And he was right most of the time. He analyzed us pretty well, so it was always interesting.’
Lyrically, the song was quite ambiguous, describing a situation concerning drugs rather than condemning or glamorising it…
‘It was basically about all the junk that me and all my friends were taking at the time. We were just trying to get out of Dodge, basically. We were trying to do something to get out of the reality of living in Wythenshawe. The lyrics are talking about all of that… Like, the line, ‘pushing pills for a rock’n’roll band…’ I knew plenty of guys who were dealing and doing just that, so it’s really just about drug-life in Wythenshawe and what was going on at the time.’
The single came out just after the band had been featured on the ‘Live At the Roxy’ album. Did the release of the two records attract interest from bigger labels ?
‘Not that we noticed… I mean, ‘Live At The Roxy’ had been a compilation of bands that most people hadn’t even heard about and Rabid was really just an idea that they’d had down at the pub, so it wasn’t as if they were getting lots of publicity for us. I talked to Mick about what was going on and what we should do to make the most of it, and that’s when he said that we should move down to London. So we did that and ended up signed to Decca. But that was rather strange because, by then, Decca were a bit archaic. Obviously, in the past they’d released early stuff by the Rolling Stones and Thin Lizzy, but they didn’t really have any ammunition from more recent times. They had no idea what was going on, which was actually fun for us because we were able to wind them up, big time. If we did something they weren’t happy about, we’d just tell them, well, that’s the punk rock attitude, and they’d be, like, Oh, okay, that’s fine then… So it was fun, and they did allow us to record ‘Do It Dog Style’ pretty much as we wanted to do it. There was no reserve on the money for that and we were even able to bring-in Mick Ronson to play on it, which was a great moment for us. The only problem was that they really didn’t seem to know how to promote us. They didn’t do a good job for us but then again, what did we know ? We were like fish out of the sea and there was no rule book for what you could do as a Punk Rock band. That kind of stuff didn’t happen until much later on so it was like we were walking on thin ice. We wanted to be famous and well-known, but we just didn’t know how to do it. We listened to other people and tried every possible way, but it was just a weird time. Things like Glam and Psychedelic Rock were over, so if a group of guys got together and started playing aggressive music, it was instantly classified as Punk. But it was really just the attitude and no-one seemed to know what to do with that. There was no book on it.’
‘Not that we noticed… I mean, ‘Live At The Roxy’ had been a compilation of bands that most people hadn’t even heard about and Rabid was really just an idea that they’d had down at the pub, so it wasn’t as if they were getting lots of publicity for us. I talked to Mick about what was going on and what we should do to make the most of it, and that’s when he said that we should move down to London. So we did that and ended up signed to Decca. But that was rather strange because, by then, Decca were a bit archaic. Obviously, in the past they’d released early stuff by the Rolling Stones and Thin Lizzy, but they didn’t really have any ammunition from more recent times. They had no idea what was going on, which was actually fun for us because we were able to wind them up, big time. If we did something they weren’t happy about, we’d just tell them, well, that’s the punk rock attitude, and they’d be, like, Oh, okay, that’s fine then… So it was fun, and they did allow us to record ‘Do It Dog Style’ pretty much as we wanted to do it. There was no reserve on the money for that and we were even able to bring-in Mick Ronson to play on it, which was a great moment for us. The only problem was that they really didn’t seem to know how to promote us. They didn’t do a good job for us but then again, what did we know ? We were like fish out of the sea and there was no rule book for what you could do as a Punk Rock band. That kind of stuff didn’t happen until much later on so it was like we were walking on thin ice. We wanted to be famous and well-known, but we just didn’t know how to do it. We listened to other people and tried every possible way, but it was just a weird time. Things like Glam and Psychedelic Rock were over, so if a group of guys got together and started playing aggressive music, it was instantly classified as Punk. But it was really just the attitude and no-one seemed to know what to do with that. There was no book on it.’
As you mentioned, Mick Ronson played on several tracks on the album. How did that come around ?
‘It was through Mick (Rossi.) He had met Mick Ronson after we had come down to London and they had got on well. So Mick very brazenly asked him if he’d like to come in to the studio and record a few things with us, and Ronno said, Yeah, alright ! It was as easy as that. So he came down to the studio and all the people working there were standing around thinking, what’s Mick Ronson doing with this band ? But it was such a great experience and I know we’ll never forget it.’
The thing is, although Bowie is often given credit for his influence on Punk, to me it was Mick Ronson’s guitar sound that was the real inspiration…
‘Of course it was ! He had such a great guitar sound, and no-one ever gets it just right. Mick gets it pretty well, because he’s worked on it a lot over the years and it’s always been the sound that we wanted in the band. The thing is, when you really listen to his playing, you have to consider what his agenda was. It was coming from the Sixties and the early Seventies but he somehow managed to get a sound that no-one else has really been able to replicate. And as much as I love David Bowie, for me, when I listen to his later albums, the one thing that’s always missing is Mick Ronson. When he stopped working with Mick Ronson, he lost his heart and soul.’
You also got to work with Dale Griffin, from Mott The Hoople, in 1979. I assume you had been fans of them as well ?
‘Oh, yeah, of course ! Mott, Bowie and Roxy Music… they were the bands we grew up listening to. So when we got the opportunity to work with Dale Griffin, that was another great moment and we had a really good time with him. We only got to record three songs together, but he did such a great job and he got such a great drum sound on ‘You’re Ready Now’. He was a really quiet person, but he knew exactly what he wanted and when he got behind the mixing table, he knew how to get it.’
He certainly seemed to be on the level with the bands he worked with…
‘Oh yeah, he never tried to act like he was a famous musician or anything. You know, some people will act like, ‘you may be up and coming, but I already am’. He was just quiet and very observant. He’d listen to every-thing you said and take it in, then see what he could add to it.’
One other band I’ve always suspected may have had an influence on Slaughter & The Dogs was Alice Cooper and I always thought the vocals on ‘I’m Mad’ (‘I gotta get out of here’) were a reference to ‘The Ballad of Dwight Frye’…
‘Oh yeah, that’s a total homage to Alice Cooper ! When I first heard ‘I’m Eighteen’, it was another of those wake-up calls. I remember hearing that and thinking, I want to listen to this for the rest of my life !
It was one of the things that made me want to play music. And when ‘School’s Out’ was released, I went and bought the album and it came like a fold-out school desk, and there was a pair of girls’ panties inside… It was just amazing, even before you started listening to the record. Alice Cooper was such an original. We had a lot of influences from that era… Slade, Roxy Music, Alex Harvey… The thing was, me and Mick used to go up to the Free Trade Hall as often as we could, sometimes three times a week. Some of the bands we saw were shit, like Lindisfarne or whatever, but then two days later, we’d see the Sensational Alex Harvey Band. The following week, we’d maybe get to see Bowie or Kiss, so there was this massive accumulation of music that we were experiencing with our own ears and eyes. We were able to decide for ourselves what was good and what was shit, so we were very lucky. I mean, you certainly can’t see as many bands like that now as we could back then. I think now, too many bands get hyped-up far too quickly and end-up playing these massive gigs before they’ve really had a chance to do anything. It’s all been taken out of proportion and it doesn’t give them a chance to develop and mature at a natural rate. I mean, I remember seeing Mott The Hoople at Manchester Apollo, and the opening band were Queen. I was with some mates and I said, in six months time, this band are going to be really hot, because I could see the work they were putting in to it. My mates weren’t so sure, so we put a bet on it. And six months later, Queen were in the charts and I got my tenner !’
‘It was through Mick (Rossi.) He had met Mick Ronson after we had come down to London and they had got on well. So Mick very brazenly asked him if he’d like to come in to the studio and record a few things with us, and Ronno said, Yeah, alright ! It was as easy as that. So he came down to the studio and all the people working there were standing around thinking, what’s Mick Ronson doing with this band ? But it was such a great experience and I know we’ll never forget it.’
The thing is, although Bowie is often given credit for his influence on Punk, to me it was Mick Ronson’s guitar sound that was the real inspiration…
‘Of course it was ! He had such a great guitar sound, and no-one ever gets it just right. Mick gets it pretty well, because he’s worked on it a lot over the years and it’s always been the sound that we wanted in the band. The thing is, when you really listen to his playing, you have to consider what his agenda was. It was coming from the Sixties and the early Seventies but he somehow managed to get a sound that no-one else has really been able to replicate. And as much as I love David Bowie, for me, when I listen to his later albums, the one thing that’s always missing is Mick Ronson. When he stopped working with Mick Ronson, he lost his heart and soul.’
You also got to work with Dale Griffin, from Mott The Hoople, in 1979. I assume you had been fans of them as well ?
‘Oh, yeah, of course ! Mott, Bowie and Roxy Music… they were the bands we grew up listening to. So when we got the opportunity to work with Dale Griffin, that was another great moment and we had a really good time with him. We only got to record three songs together, but he did such a great job and he got such a great drum sound on ‘You’re Ready Now’. He was a really quiet person, but he knew exactly what he wanted and when he got behind the mixing table, he knew how to get it.’
He certainly seemed to be on the level with the bands he worked with…
‘Oh yeah, he never tried to act like he was a famous musician or anything. You know, some people will act like, ‘you may be up and coming, but I already am’. He was just quiet and very observant. He’d listen to every-thing you said and take it in, then see what he could add to it.’
One other band I’ve always suspected may have had an influence on Slaughter & The Dogs was Alice Cooper and I always thought the vocals on ‘I’m Mad’ (‘I gotta get out of here’) were a reference to ‘The Ballad of Dwight Frye’…
‘Oh yeah, that’s a total homage to Alice Cooper ! When I first heard ‘I’m Eighteen’, it was another of those wake-up calls. I remember hearing that and thinking, I want to listen to this for the rest of my life !
It was one of the things that made me want to play music. And when ‘School’s Out’ was released, I went and bought the album and it came like a fold-out school desk, and there was a pair of girls’ panties inside… It was just amazing, even before you started listening to the record. Alice Cooper was such an original. We had a lot of influences from that era… Slade, Roxy Music, Alex Harvey… The thing was, me and Mick used to go up to the Free Trade Hall as often as we could, sometimes three times a week. Some of the bands we saw were shit, like Lindisfarne or whatever, but then two days later, we’d see the Sensational Alex Harvey Band. The following week, we’d maybe get to see Bowie or Kiss, so there was this massive accumulation of music that we were experiencing with our own ears and eyes. We were able to decide for ourselves what was good and what was shit, so we were very lucky. I mean, you certainly can’t see as many bands like that now as we could back then. I think now, too many bands get hyped-up far too quickly and end-up playing these massive gigs before they’ve really had a chance to do anything. It’s all been taken out of proportion and it doesn’t give them a chance to develop and mature at a natural rate. I mean, I remember seeing Mott The Hoople at Manchester Apollo, and the opening band were Queen. I was with some mates and I said, in six months time, this band are going to be really hot, because I could see the work they were putting in to it. My mates weren’t so sure, so we put a bet on it. And six months later, Queen were in the charts and I got my tenner !’
Despite remaining a popular live band, Slaughter & The Dogs broke-up before a second album could be recorded…
‘I think there were just too many differences. Someone at the record company had started telling me that I ought to release a record on my own, even before our next album had come out. I’d also been to Europe by then and I’d liked that experience, so I started becoming influenced by certain people who I probably shouldn’t have been listening to at the time. I ended up taking their advice on a few things and came to the conclusion that I’d gone far enough with the band and I should try something else. I said to the rest of the guys that I wanted some time to do something else, but they didn’t want to listen to me and wanted to continue, so I buggered off to France. Muffet had already left the band and gone back to Manchester by then, so we had Phil Rowland from Eater on drums. Mick and Howard decided to get a guy called Eddie from The Nosebleeds, and they decided to continue the band under the name ‘Slaughter’. The thing was, I just wasn’t finding it to be fun anymore and I needed to do something different. We’d left Decca after the first album but had a new deal with DJM in Manchester. They tried to salvage what they could from the record deal, but really, I’d left them in the shit and it’s something that I’ve regretted ever since. It was a very bad move. Mick is like my brother, I’ve known him longer than anyone else. Anyway, after the fires died down, we started talking again and realised that we were still friends. I was starting to work in France and Mick was also just about to start working with Gary Holton, so we kept in contact and that’s how it stayed.’
It would prove to be more than a decade before Slaughter & The Dogs worked together again…
‘Yeah, Receiver Records got in touch and asked if we’d be interested in making a new album ? We brought in a new drummer, Noel, and bass player, Nigel, and that resulted in the album ‘Shocking’. But I’d have to say, it was really only half an album. We used it as an experiment to see if we could work together again and I think we were happy with what we did, but we were both still involved with other projects and weren’t entirely focused on that album. And we didn’t get a chance to follow it up because I was still in France and Mick had moved to America around that time.’
‘I think there were just too many differences. Someone at the record company had started telling me that I ought to release a record on my own, even before our next album had come out. I’d also been to Europe by then and I’d liked that experience, so I started becoming influenced by certain people who I probably shouldn’t have been listening to at the time. I ended up taking their advice on a few things and came to the conclusion that I’d gone far enough with the band and I should try something else. I said to the rest of the guys that I wanted some time to do something else, but they didn’t want to listen to me and wanted to continue, so I buggered off to France. Muffet had already left the band and gone back to Manchester by then, so we had Phil Rowland from Eater on drums. Mick and Howard decided to get a guy called Eddie from The Nosebleeds, and they decided to continue the band under the name ‘Slaughter’. The thing was, I just wasn’t finding it to be fun anymore and I needed to do something different. We’d left Decca after the first album but had a new deal with DJM in Manchester. They tried to salvage what they could from the record deal, but really, I’d left them in the shit and it’s something that I’ve regretted ever since. It was a very bad move. Mick is like my brother, I’ve known him longer than anyone else. Anyway, after the fires died down, we started talking again and realised that we were still friends. I was starting to work in France and Mick was also just about to start working with Gary Holton, so we kept in contact and that’s how it stayed.’
It would prove to be more than a decade before Slaughter & The Dogs worked together again…
‘Yeah, Receiver Records got in touch and asked if we’d be interested in making a new album ? We brought in a new drummer, Noel, and bass player, Nigel, and that resulted in the album ‘Shocking’. But I’d have to say, it was really only half an album. We used it as an experiment to see if we could work together again and I think we were happy with what we did, but we were both still involved with other projects and weren’t entirely focused on that album. And we didn’t get a chance to follow it up because I was still in France and Mick had moved to America around that time.’
You finally reformed to play live again in 1996, at the Holidays In The Sun festival in Blackpool…
‘Mick ‘phoned me up one day and said there was a promoter who really wanted us to play a gig as Slaughter & The Dogs. He asked me if I fancied it and right then, I thought it was great idea. We used the same line-up that had recorded ‘Shocking’, even though that was five years earlier, but we knew that we got along well and had even played together in different projects in between. Neither of us were in touch with Howard or Muffet by then, so we decided to do it like that. It went ahead, we enjoyed it and it went down really well, so since then, we’ve continued playing and recording whenever we’ve had the opportunity. Nigel wasn’t able to continue playing with us, but Noel was with us all the way up until last year, when we sadly lost him in an accident. So currently, we have a fairly new line-up with Mark Reback on drums and Dan Graziano on bass, and they’ve proved to be a really great rhythm section. We’ve been very happy with them.’
A year ago, you played a 40th Anniversary concert in Manchester, with both Howard and Muffet back in the band for the first time since 1978. By all accounts, the concert was a big success, so was there any talk of that line-up doing anything else together ?
‘ Mick and myself had spoken about it, to decide whether we should do it. For all intent and purposes, Slaughter & The Dogs has always been Mick Rossi and Wayne Barrett… we’ve always written the songs and always will do. It’s our collaboration that makes the band and we could only do Slaughter & The Dogs if both of us are there. We started talking about doing that Anniversary gig and had to decide if we could do it. I didn’t know what Howard had been doing, although I did know that Muffet was still playing with various bands around Manchester, but they’d never tried to contact us and we didn’t really know if they’d be up for it. So when we were asked if we would like to do the 40th Anniversary thing and the Rebellion thing afterwards, we said, alright, we’ll see what happens. We did the shows and it was great to see them, but afterwards I think we all agreed that we weren’t on the same wavelength anymore. You know, time changes people… when you think of your school-friends, you think of them as they were. But over 40 years, people are going to change and you have to respect that. It was really good to do that one-off thing, but afterwards we realised that we had to get back to what we’re doing now. Which is why we recorded the new album with the American guys, and that is what Slaughter & The Dogs is today. When we play with Dan and Mark, both Mick and myself consider them as members of Slaughter & The Dogs. That’s what they are now. We recorded the new album, ‘Vicious’, together and they were a very important part of it. When we finish this tour, we’ll be going back to America to record another album for the same label, Cleopatra, and there’s also going to be a new live album coming out. So there’s a lot of activity going on and this line-up is proving to be the best one for it.’
‘Mick ‘phoned me up one day and said there was a promoter who really wanted us to play a gig as Slaughter & The Dogs. He asked me if I fancied it and right then, I thought it was great idea. We used the same line-up that had recorded ‘Shocking’, even though that was five years earlier, but we knew that we got along well and had even played together in different projects in between. Neither of us were in touch with Howard or Muffet by then, so we decided to do it like that. It went ahead, we enjoyed it and it went down really well, so since then, we’ve continued playing and recording whenever we’ve had the opportunity. Nigel wasn’t able to continue playing with us, but Noel was with us all the way up until last year, when we sadly lost him in an accident. So currently, we have a fairly new line-up with Mark Reback on drums and Dan Graziano on bass, and they’ve proved to be a really great rhythm section. We’ve been very happy with them.’
A year ago, you played a 40th Anniversary concert in Manchester, with both Howard and Muffet back in the band for the first time since 1978. By all accounts, the concert was a big success, so was there any talk of that line-up doing anything else together ?
‘ Mick and myself had spoken about it, to decide whether we should do it. For all intent and purposes, Slaughter & The Dogs has always been Mick Rossi and Wayne Barrett… we’ve always written the songs and always will do. It’s our collaboration that makes the band and we could only do Slaughter & The Dogs if both of us are there. We started talking about doing that Anniversary gig and had to decide if we could do it. I didn’t know what Howard had been doing, although I did know that Muffet was still playing with various bands around Manchester, but they’d never tried to contact us and we didn’t really know if they’d be up for it. So when we were asked if we would like to do the 40th Anniversary thing and the Rebellion thing afterwards, we said, alright, we’ll see what happens. We did the shows and it was great to see them, but afterwards I think we all agreed that we weren’t on the same wavelength anymore. You know, time changes people… when you think of your school-friends, you think of them as they were. But over 40 years, people are going to change and you have to respect that. It was really good to do that one-off thing, but afterwards we realised that we had to get back to what we’re doing now. Which is why we recorded the new album with the American guys, and that is what Slaughter & The Dogs is today. When we play with Dan and Mark, both Mick and myself consider them as members of Slaughter & The Dogs. That’s what they are now. We recorded the new album, ‘Vicious’, together and they were a very important part of it. When we finish this tour, we’ll be going back to America to record another album for the same label, Cleopatra, and there’s also going to be a new live album coming out. So there’s a lot of activity going on and this line-up is proving to be the best one for it.’
‘Vicious’ has certainly received some great reviews and a lot of fans have said that it really recaptures your original style…
‘Yeah, I think that’s how we look at it. Mark and Dan have really added something to it. Their playing is legit and you can hear their enthusiasm on the record. The thing is, a lot of our original records still sound good today because basically, we were writing high-energy rock’n’roll and that still remains valid in itself, even though at the time we were being labelled as ‘punk’. Other bands from that era sound dated now because they were just trying to fit-in with the one thing. Of course, like we said earlier, it all depends on how you define ‘punk’ or ‘rock’n’roll’, but we just set out to play and it was other people who started calling us ‘punk’. We didn’t even know what they meant at first… we thought it something to do with Jimmy Cagney !’
Funnily enough, you cover ‘Get It On’ on the new album. Marc Bolan had actually been using the terms ‘punk’ or ‘punkoid’ for some time to describe his music, and he also turned out to be one of the few established stars to support the new scene…
‘Oh yeah, he was an innovator. He’d bring things in to his music, or take it out or change it… He went from acoustic guitar to electric guitar and initially, a lot of people – even John Peel - criticised him for that. But he continued on with it because it was what he felt he had to do. He couldn’t be in thrall to the media because he believed in it. I mean, a lot of what he did was to pick up on things that other people were doing or had already done, and adapt it to what he was doing, in much the same way that Bowie did. But there’s nothing wrong with that, everybody does that to some extent. What matters is how they do it and people like Bowie and Bolan did it really well.’
You’ve already mentioned that you’re planning to start work on a new album after this tour. Have you any ideas how it’s going to turn out, as yet ?
‘Well, it’s still a bit hush-hush, as we’re still working on the songs for it. But I think it’ll be along similar lines to ‘Vicious’, as we were all really happy with that. We’re going to record it in Hollywood again, because we really enjoyed that experience last time. We’ve also been really happy how things have been going since ‘Vicious’ came out, so we said we’d like to work on another record and the label have told us they’d like to be onboard for it, so it looks as if it’ll be going ahead sooner rather than later.’
Okay, final question, and this is something that I’m curious about because it’s been repeated many times but I’ve never actually heard the truth about it… Did Morrissey ever audition to be a member of Slaughter & The Dogs ?
‘Ahhh, that story is so boring ! I hate that story… there’s no truth in it at all. There was never a Morrissey in Slaughter & The Dogs and there never will be. We wouldn’t want him… He did try to get involved with something that Mick was doing later on, but it was never Slaughter & The Dogs because, like I said, that would have to be both me and Mick. But I don’t think rather of us would ever have wanted to play with him. He’s a pork-pie dodger !’
‘Yeah, I think that’s how we look at it. Mark and Dan have really added something to it. Their playing is legit and you can hear their enthusiasm on the record. The thing is, a lot of our original records still sound good today because basically, we were writing high-energy rock’n’roll and that still remains valid in itself, even though at the time we were being labelled as ‘punk’. Other bands from that era sound dated now because they were just trying to fit-in with the one thing. Of course, like we said earlier, it all depends on how you define ‘punk’ or ‘rock’n’roll’, but we just set out to play and it was other people who started calling us ‘punk’. We didn’t even know what they meant at first… we thought it something to do with Jimmy Cagney !’
Funnily enough, you cover ‘Get It On’ on the new album. Marc Bolan had actually been using the terms ‘punk’ or ‘punkoid’ for some time to describe his music, and he also turned out to be one of the few established stars to support the new scene…
‘Oh yeah, he was an innovator. He’d bring things in to his music, or take it out or change it… He went from acoustic guitar to electric guitar and initially, a lot of people – even John Peel - criticised him for that. But he continued on with it because it was what he felt he had to do. He couldn’t be in thrall to the media because he believed in it. I mean, a lot of what he did was to pick up on things that other people were doing or had already done, and adapt it to what he was doing, in much the same way that Bowie did. But there’s nothing wrong with that, everybody does that to some extent. What matters is how they do it and people like Bowie and Bolan did it really well.’
You’ve already mentioned that you’re planning to start work on a new album after this tour. Have you any ideas how it’s going to turn out, as yet ?
‘Well, it’s still a bit hush-hush, as we’re still working on the songs for it. But I think it’ll be along similar lines to ‘Vicious’, as we were all really happy with that. We’re going to record it in Hollywood again, because we really enjoyed that experience last time. We’ve also been really happy how things have been going since ‘Vicious’ came out, so we said we’d like to work on another record and the label have told us they’d like to be onboard for it, so it looks as if it’ll be going ahead sooner rather than later.’
Okay, final question, and this is something that I’m curious about because it’s been repeated many times but I’ve never actually heard the truth about it… Did Morrissey ever audition to be a member of Slaughter & The Dogs ?
‘Ahhh, that story is so boring ! I hate that story… there’s no truth in it at all. There was never a Morrissey in Slaughter & The Dogs and there never will be. We wouldn’t want him… He did try to get involved with something that Mick was doing later on, but it was never Slaughter & The Dogs because, like I said, that would have to be both me and Mick. But I don’t think rather of us would ever have wanted to play with him. He’s a pork-pie dodger !’
On that astute observation, we end the interview as it’s another early start to proceedings and I’m certainly not going to miss the DeRellas again. I don’t have to wait long for their set and, with the PA sounding really great tonight, they’re on top form. blasting through a short, sharp set of songs, they prove to be a perfect mix of punk rock and glam to warm-up the crowd. I’m sure they won themselves quite a few new fans over these two nights, and I’m still rather miffed that I missed them the night before.
The place is packed by the time the headliners arrive onstage, and you can tell from the atmosphere that it’s going to be even better than the first evening. From the start, the overall sound is much more powerful, with Micks’ guitar really cutting through the place, while Wayne handles the vocals with real panache and the rhythm section hold everything down with plenty of precision and energy. It’s the same set as before, which is a pity as there are a few other songs that I would really like to have heard, but it’s certainly not a disappointment, and the finale is just as exciting. Tony James rejoins them and this time you can see he’s really enjoying himself, interacting with the rest of the band for those two songs and really becoming a part of it. Again, despite enthusiastic calls, there are no further songs, but by leaving everyone wanting more, they keep it open for another return to London in the future. I can only hope that they don’t keep us waiting so long for the next time !
www.satd.band
The place is packed by the time the headliners arrive onstage, and you can tell from the atmosphere that it’s going to be even better than the first evening. From the start, the overall sound is much more powerful, with Micks’ guitar really cutting through the place, while Wayne handles the vocals with real panache and the rhythm section hold everything down with plenty of precision and energy. It’s the same set as before, which is a pity as there are a few other songs that I would really like to have heard, but it’s certainly not a disappointment, and the finale is just as exciting. Tony James rejoins them and this time you can see he’s really enjoying himself, interacting with the rest of the band for those two songs and really becoming a part of it. Again, despite enthusiastic calls, there are no further songs, but by leaving everyone wanting more, they keep it open for another return to London in the future. I can only hope that they don’t keep us waiting so long for the next time !
www.satd.band
